1963 Idles and quits

[sombb]

Hello,

I recently acquired a 1963 Landau, which has had start problems all along. In following the factory manual for tuning fuel and ignition, I'm now down to one start a day ;-0: the car runs for 10 minutes, rumbles for 10 seconds, then quits and can't be re-started. Very frustrating that I can't even get to the Ford factory manual start point, 30 minutes at idle, to make a second round of adjustments. I'm not certain "idle" is the right term, as the "idle circuit" is not the prime operator, when the Bird won't idle below 2000 rpm. Inspection of plugs and compression show when the engine does run, black soot deposits and black exhaust result.(see photos)

I have installed new: start switch, starter relay, fuel pump, spark plugs, rebuilt Autolite 4100 carb, fuel pressure regulator set to 4.5 psi. The previous owner installed a Pertronix ignition, which I've matched with a Pertronix FlameThrower coil. I have cleaned all fuel lines back to the tank. Timing is properly set to spec, 8 degrees BTDC (tho' only set way above normal idle speed). Electric choke added, set to center hash mark on the choke dial. Choke valve opens completely.

I must screw down the idle speed screw way past what I'd normally think reasonable, to its max. On a start several days ago, I was able to idle with settings: 4 degrees BTDC, 750 rpm via idle speed screw, then on to idle mixture screws. The mixture screws in or out (from specified 1 1/2 turns out) made absolutely no difference in idle speed, including 100% closed which should, but did NOT, kill the engine. A check for vacuum leaks found vac lines OK, and a listen with stethoscope at carb spacer gaskets top and bottom and along intake manifold gaskets revealed no sound of hissing air.

So, trying to get to 30 minutes full operating temp but never get there. Then the car grinds the starter until the battery must be re-charged, and will not re-start. Wait overnight, and my "one start a day," rinse and repeat. Any suggestions?

[MN63Tbird]

One thought is the Flame thrower coil since you said you recently replaced it. The resistance in the system should match what is recommended by the Pertronix ingnition which I believe is 1.5 ohms for most. The Flame Thrower coils you can purchase are 0.6 1.5 and 3 ohms . Original 63 Tbirds had a pink resistance wire from the ignition to the coil that I believe was 1.4 ohms. You need to check if that wire is still there. Since you had pertronix points from the previous owner they may have removed or bypassed that wire. If it is still there than the resistance would most likely be greater than recommended. If you end up with too much resistance in the circuit the coil can overheat and when that happens your engine will stop. Depending on the load the engine dying in 10to 15 minutes would fit the bill. If it is significantly overheating it will be too hot to touch.

One other thing to watch out with the Flame thrower coils is dont leave the ignition in the on position for long if the car dies. If it is left on for more than a few seconds that also will send current to your coil and fry it. Been there done that. A fried coil will make starting difficult to impossible. Always shut it off if has died.

Good luck troubleshooting.

MN63

[Ducksface]

My cracked coil allowed for one cold start.
Then the heat expanded the crack and I had nothing.
It's an easy test.
If the coil doesn't spark, it's the coil.

[scumdog]

Immediately after the engine cuts out have a look down the throat of the carb to see if it’s dripping with fuel.
Also try running the engine with a temporary fuel supply that you can stop the flow of fuel when the engine starts to cut out.

But the coil scenario would be well worth considering. ( I had a Harley ‘losing’ the spark to one cylinder when the motor got warm, OK on the highway but at the first stop light etc it was down to one lung, a crack in the coil would open a tiny amount and that was enough to lose the spark at that end of the coil)