Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

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Terry64HT
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Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by Terry64HT » Wed Dec 04, 2019 12:56 pm

I'm looking to replace the filter in the power steering reservoir on my 64 with A/C. The original ones were 2 1/2 inches in diameter and were a Baldwin P450. They are almost impossible to find now except for a few dealers like Mac's. If you go to a regular supplier, they cross reference to a WIX51653 or equivalent. It's the same height and inside diameter, but is 3" OD. Can someone with a 64 measure the diameter of the remote reservoir?
Thanks
Terry
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RAVEN
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by RAVEN » Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:57 pm

I.D. of reservoir is 3.50 inches
Take note, internal filter fits into a base which is 2.50" flanged so a 3.00" diameter filter will not fit. Plus the filter is offset within the housing.
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Flock: 1964 Landau Original Family Owned
1964 Sr Convertible "RAVEN"
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paulr
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by paulr » Wed Dec 04, 2019 6:03 pm

It's not gonna fit. I got 3.5" and as you know, the threaded rod is offset about 1.5" from the side. I got my filter from the Bird Nest several years ago. I can't say what the brand is. Try giving them a call.
The large filter you're looking at may be suited to the non-AC cars which have a bigger reservoir. I've always wondered why.
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Paul
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RAVEN
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by RAVEN » Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:17 am

Just for reference, the NON-AIR car steering pump reservoir filter is 2.50" OD;; 1.00" I'D; and 1.50" Tall.
As in the AIR car and NON-AIR car they both have a flanged inner cup that the filter sits in/on, and is 2.50" in diameter, plus offset in the reservoir.
A 3.00" filter would not fit in a NON-AIR car either.
CDN Member since 1975 #2086
Flock: 1964 Landau Original Family Owned
1964 Sr Convertible "RAVEN"
Past: 2003 Blk Lab "RAVEN" "RIP"Nov 15/17
1964 Lincoln vin4Y86N00007
1964 Red Convertible

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paulr
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by paulr » Thu Dec 05, 2019 11:59 am

Good to know, Wally. I thought 3” sounds huge. Macs sells tons of stuff that looks suspicious; you always have to do your own research before ordering.
Paul
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"Beer, now there's a temporary solution!" ~Homer Simpson

Terry64HT
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by Terry64HT » Thu Dec 05, 2019 1:47 pm

Thanks for all the info. It's pretty well what I suspected, although I took Paul's photos and rescaled them to 1:1 and I think the filter might fit. There is a cork gasket on both ends that is 2 inches in diameter with a 1 inch hole. The filter is 1.4 inches high without the gaskets and 1.6 with. The bottom gasket would probably fit inside the flange of the bottom cup and the outer edge would almost touch the side of the reservoir. I think it would have about 40% more filter area, so would be far less restriction and easier on the pump.
All that being said, I don't plan to experiment, but will source a 2 1/2" filter.
Interestingly, Mac's catalog is the only one I have found that gives dimensions for the filter and lists the 3" at $11.49 as OEM replacement and a 2 1/2" at $25.99 as an aftermarket version. It's not the first time I've found less than complete or downright incorrect info in their catalog. Things sure have changed since they were bought out.
As a side note, Paul, do you have a retainer on the top of the filter? I believe there should be, otherwise fluid will be drawn over the top and to the pump and the filter will do almost nothing. Keeping the fluid level below the top of the filter will help but probably cause cavitation.

Terry
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paulr
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by paulr » Thu Dec 05, 2019 2:25 pm

Screenshot 2019-12-05 10.10.34.png
2 3/8" diameter is the width you want. The photo above is a Fram filter #C1654PL.

I'm only know what I've been taught by more experienced Tbird persons. There shouldn't be a topside retainer. The setup as shown in the diagram below is what I have and it hasn't had any problems to mention. Diagram shows non-AC, but it's the same.
Page80.jpg
Paul
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Terry64HT
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by Terry64HT » Thu Dec 05, 2019 3:05 pm

Thanks Paul. There are references to the 2 3/8 or 2 1/2' filter in a lot of supplier catalogs, but it seems to be pretty rare. I don't doubt that it is the correct one, but I was wondering about the different sizes. I'm now beginning to suspect that the 3" one is for early Tbirds, but there is not much specific information.
In your last post, the diagram shows part 3B754-A which is the filter spring retainer seat that sits on top of the filter. The spring is on top of that so the filter is held in position. That's the part I was referring to.
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by RAVEN » Thu Dec 05, 2019 3:14 pm

Just so everyone knows, there is a retainer plate/washer on top of the filter with the spring on top.
In a NON-AIR set up the bolt is fed from the top on the cover, down through, then the spring, then the retain plate, then filter.
In a AIR set up, there is a stud which is mounted to the reservoir base, which the bottom plate sits, then filter, then retainer, spring, and finally the cover sits on the reservoir, and a wing nut, to clamp it all together.
In simple terms, both are the same, only one "BOLTS" Down, and the other sits on a STUD And is clamped down with the wing nut.
ALSO to note, the fluid is push filtered from inside to outside through the filter membrane. If there were no retainer plates, the oil would just push the unit off its base or flow over the top and bypass. The retainer spring acts as a pressure relief. If filter is plugged the pressure pushes/blows the filter off its seat and would bypass.
ALSO note the pump is basically gravity fed from the reservoir, and is a story for another day when the pump squeals, and is a pain to purge/bleed.*
CDN Member since 1975 #2086
Flock: 1964 Landau Original Family Owned
1964 Sr Convertible "RAVEN"
Past: 2003 Blk Lab "RAVEN" "RIP"Nov 15/17
1964 Lincoln vin4Y86N00007
1964 Red Convertible

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paulr
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Re: Power Steering Filter 64 with A/C

Post by paulr » Thu Dec 05, 2019 7:43 pm

Terry64HT wrote:
Thu Dec 05, 2019 3:05 pm
.
In your last post, the diagram shows part 3B754-A which is the filter spring retainer seat that sits on top of the filter. The spring is on top of that so the filter is held in position. That's the part I was referring to.
Terry
64HT
True. I never think of that part as mate for the bottom part—it makes sense as a retainer. Hope you can get the filter you want. If you had the one I have your search would be over. Good luck 👍🏻
Paul
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Registry 45122
'64 Landau HT
"Beer, now there's a temporary solution!" ~Homer Simpson

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