Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

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1966ConvGinger
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Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by 1966ConvGinger »

Hello Tbird lovers. My car was accepted to participate and be judged at this year's Hillsborough concours d'Elegance on July 18th and I would like to get input and feedback from all of you who have judged before in other similar events. I will be posting several pictures of the underside of the hood hoping to get your opinions. My car is a 1966 convertible and I am also an active member of the VTCI. I am looking forward to your constructive criticism. A few items that I know will have to be addressed are to remove the battery shutoff switch, add a new correct ground battery cable, power booster color and .........
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RAVEN
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by RAVEN »

Of those willing to point out areas of concern, how critical do you wish to be studied? Are you prepared to be challenged?
Is your Concours d' a high level show, or a high level gathering.
A purchase of the VTCI Original Factory Specs, would be a good place to start. It provides the information to have a base line to work with. On another post it appears you have been a FORUM observer for several years, but not active.
Let us know your wishes.
CDN Member since 1975 #2086
Flock: 1964 Landau Original Family Owned
1964 Sr Convertible "RAVEN"
Past: 2003 Blk Lab "RAVEN" "RIP"Nov 15/17
1964 Lincoln vin4Y86N00007
1964 Red Convertible
1966ConvGinger
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Joined: Mon Jan 25, 2016 1:53 am

Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by 1966ConvGinger »

My approach to this exercise is to make reasonable improvements to what's already been done in my car. Any settled changes I can make to the engine bay will be a plus. Of course, the engine will not come out or anything like that, but I have 3 weeks to make improvements. I am fine with the challenge, I love my Thunderbird and I know that it's not perfect but I am opened to your suggestions and comments and will try to incorporate them to minimize the point deductions. The level of scrutiny by the judges at the Hillsborough concours d'elegance is unknown to me since it's the first time that my car will be reviewed but I am sure it will be high. I already purchased the VTCI Original Factory Specs from the club and should be on its way. Regarding my participation on other forums, that was a few years ago shortly after I purchased my Thunderbird. I am more active in the 64 to 66 Thunderbirds on Facebook. I recently renewed my membership with VTCI as well. I promise that I will not have my feelings hurt and in the spirit of competition, I want to reach the highest score within some restrictions like budget and time. Thanks in advance.
1966ConvGinger
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by 1966ConvGinger »

For reference, here is the webpage of the concours: https://www.hillsboroughconcours.org/
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Alan H. Tast
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by Alan H. Tast »

Posting additional pictures of the car showing its overall condition, including the interior, top, trunk and underside would be helpful to establish a baseline and determine what else can be done.

Just from the engine bay pics I can suggest removing the Fuel Filter decal on the inner fender (should be on the fuel filter can at the bottom of the fuel pump) and remove/replace the ignition coil decal toward the bottom side of the coil body. A heat gun, plastic scraper and adhesive remover on a rag will help to soften the plastic film and make the adhesive easier to scrub off.

Also look in recent articles in the Club's Thunderbird Scoop magazine on hang tags used inside the car.
Alan H. Tast, AIA
Technical Director/Past President,
Vintage Thunderbird Club Int'l.
Author, "Thunderbird 1955-1966" & "Thunderbird 50 Years"
1963 Hardtop & 1963 Sports Roadster
1966ConvGinger
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by 1966ConvGinger »

Hi Alan,
Thanks for taking the time to look at the pictures and give me a few good tips. The good thing is that none of them are new to me and I am working on the process of addressing these changes. I also painted the brake booster in black. I need to remove the battery shut off switch and replace the ground cable with the longer original style from Bird Nest Parts from Oregon. Other than the interior, I am very confident that the interior and exterior are going to be as good as they are now. Besides from the heavy cleaning and polishing, it's all working well, down to the clock. All of your advise for under the hood will be super appreciated. Luis
1966ConvGinger
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by 1966ConvGinger »

Here are some overall picture of the car. A few notes: the original owner performed a large restoration of his car in 2009 which included the body color which is not a Thunderbird color and the soft top was changed to burgundy fabric. The interior is true to the door plate (25 = red), the V8 original 390 engine was rebuilt 3 years ago as well as the original transmission and rear end axle.
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redstangbob
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by redstangbob »

I could pick on the coil and the Neg lead. The coil has a yellow top but is not an accurate repop, the posts are opposite each other. Also I would assume you have a Pertronix unit by the color of the ring terminal on the Neg side. JMO, Bob C
It's gonna be cool when it's done
And now it's really cool !!



59 convertible
58 convertible
65 hardtop
1966ConvGinger
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by 1966ConvGinger »

You are absolutely correct, I do have Pertronix and the coil is the one that came with the whole package. Can you send a picture of the correct period coil?. Maybe I can replace it for the show, only. Thanks.
RAVEN
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by RAVEN »

Going over the photos, some items stand out.
All underhood brace bolts show rust colour, which should be Black Phos finish, including the fan shroud bolts.
Decals need verification and location adjustment.
The underhood wire looms show age and discoloration along with vac lines, a little Armour-all can fix that.
Realize you will not change them but the hood hinges should be GREY Phos, not Yellow Zinc.
It would appear that the driver side inner fender has some holes.
Hard to see horns, and they may need touch up.
These are some quick observances.
CDN Member since 1975 #2086
Flock: 1964 Landau Original Family Owned
1964 Sr Convertible "RAVEN"
Past: 2003 Blk Lab "RAVEN" "RIP"Nov 15/17
1964 Lincoln vin4Y86N00007
1964 Red Convertible
1966ConvGinger
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by 1966ConvGinger »

I am taking notes of all these details. Keep them coming. I already started to address some of your comments. Thanks Raven!
RAVEN
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by RAVEN »

If you could provide more detailed, closer framed photos of the engine bay, it would help.
The obvious currently can be seen, but the fine details, not.
How about the trunk area? Another place to be judged and perhaps picked on by the Concourse members.

Many are reserved to comment, either because they do not want to hurt your feelings, or are unsure of what is correct. This is where the OFS gives a direct answer. Hope it arrives in time to be a help in prepping your car.
CDN Member since 1975 #2086
Flock: 1964 Landau Original Family Owned
1964 Sr Convertible "RAVEN"
Past: 2003 Blk Lab "RAVEN" "RIP"Nov 15/17
1964 Lincoln vin4Y86N00007
1964 Red Convertible
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Alan H. Tast
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Location: Omaha, NE

Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by Alan H. Tast »

Find out what you can about the event - sometimes you get lucky if they post their 'rules' about judging, how and what can be displayed with the car to tell its story or educate the judges, and what their evaluation criteria is. Talk with others (if they're willing) about their past experiences and how they felt the judging process worked (was it a 'good-old-boy' event, for instance, or were the judges even aware of what they were looking at).

Because of all the variables between different years, makes and models for them to look at, more likely than not your judges will be looking at how clean the car is (and I mean really nit-picky), what are the panel gaps like, is there any obvious flaws like paint runs, dents or scratches, or how shiny is the paint. In short, events like this are a beauty contest, with attention to detail and authenticity being big eye-candy factors that separates the hard-core participants from the weekend parking-lot cruisers. The more it appears to look correct, the better your chances. A set of valve covers and air cleaner that advertise a speed parts manufacturer, along with neon-colored fat spark plug wires or etched glass with something 'cute' that personalizes the car, or that set of 20" CNC-machined wheels with skinny tire sidewalls, will stand out like a sore thumb at an event like this when compared against something that appears to have just come out of the dealer's showroom when new. So, the closer you are to 'looking the part' of a preserved old car versus customized or 'hot-rodded,' the better.

The good (and bad) thing about events like this is that those who are judges most times are picked or selected because they have some kind of experience in antique and vintage cars, and many times they are attempting to evaluate something on its appearance versus authenticity. Like in the AACA, they're asked to be well-versed on all things but will often have no idea about a make's individual quirks or unique features. Or, the judges could be some celebrities or local dignitaries whom have absolutely no idea what to look for, except for what catches their eye and looks good to them. If you're lucky, sometimes they're given a brief list of things to look for - attention to detail, cleanliness, appearance, and maybe a smattering of evaluation for 'authenticity' (i.e. is it a '36 Cord with a late-model sealed-top AGM battery?), but there's always that one person out there who goes gaga over the exotic induction system or the 'bling' of chrome everywhere. Cases in point: you may get someone like the mayor of Stubsville, who doesn't know an ignition coil from a coil-over shock absorber, and simply likes the best red '59 Cadillac Eldorado on the show field. Or, you may get a well-known race car driver who has an appreciation for what it takes to restore and maintain an older car but feels more comfortable around race cars and gives them higher marks because it's what he likes and knows about.

Long story short - play to your audience and evaluators, but do so in such a convincing manner that you can back up what you're presenting with documentation and facts. Having a copy of the OFS handy will help with that, as many groups out there don't have a similar guide to go by.
Alan H. Tast, AIA
Technical Director/Past President,
Vintage Thunderbird Club Int'l.
Author, "Thunderbird 1955-1966" & "Thunderbird 50 Years"
1963 Hardtop & 1963 Sports Roadster
Scott6T6
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by Scott6T6 »

What Alan said is right on the money regarding those judging the cars and what they'll be looking for. I seriously doubt if any of these judges are going to be experts on mid sixties Fords and certainly not 1966 Thunderbirds.

Having said that, I will offer a few suggestions on items I see that stand out when I look at your engine bay that will certainly make your '66 more factory correct should you choose to follow my advice and correct them.

The 390 CID decal on the air cleaner is incorrect. You need the decal that has the BLACK & WHITE checkered flags on either side. Also make certain it has 4V PREMIUM FUEL. Here's a link for the proper decal on ebay - https://www.ebay.com/itm/161556758266?h ... SwYGFUs0Xp

Your power brake booster, master cylinder, master cylinder cap & clips should all be painted semi - gloss black.
Remove the round decal from the oil filler cap - '66 Thunderbirds never had one.
You should have this 1965 - '67 AUTOLITE SPARK PLUGS decal in place of the one you now have on the left side of your air cleaner. Your current decal is a two color, red and white reproduction - which is not correct. ECS Automotive Concepts has reproduced this decal in the correct 3 - colors, orange/black/white. You can find it on their website.
The CAUTION FAN decal is also incorrect and needs to go, but I'd hold off on that for now. Wally "RAVEN" is presently working on his '66/'67 3 - color version with MADE IN U. S. A. printed in white. I understand that one may be completed soon and that would be the CAUTION FAN decal you would want to have on your '66. Wally advertises his decals in the Thunderbird Scoop.

I am impressed with your '66 Convertible. It looks like a very fine example. A little "fine tuning" will take 'er up a notch in regard to accuracy!
Scott
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RAVEN
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Re: Accepting tips to improve my 66 before a Concours d'Elegance

Post by RAVEN »

It so happens the 65 and the 66 FAN decal is being worked on presently. Awaiting the proofs before production for colour and clearity
DO NOT think will be ready in time, factoring in shipping time. The Post Office is running a 2 week time line.
I am hoping to have them for the Nats in Portland in August. If true, they will be on a very contending planned Senior car (66 Convert) and viewing will be possible. Crossing my fingers.
CDN Member since 1975 #2086
Flock: 1964 Landau Original Family Owned
1964 Sr Convertible "RAVEN"
Past: 2003 Blk Lab "RAVEN" "RIP"Nov 15/17
1964 Lincoln vin4Y86N00007
1964 Red Convertible
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