It's not cheap - $475 - but it might be a way to avoid the headaches of trying to put something together that will have both the dual reservoir function and enough clearance for my aftermarket valve covers. The Jamco booster is a 7" diameter unit. I believe the original is around 9" or so.
ALSO: I just talked to a Jamco rep and he said that the dual reservoir MC does NOT require cutting or modding the under-hood brace from the shock tower. IF YOU'VE USED THIS CONVERSION, please let me know if that's accurate or not. He also said I can use the Russell proportioning valve that I've already purchased with this Jamco conversion.
So, if you've installed and used this conversion, please let me know what you think, good or bad. How was the installation? How was the function and braking performance? Thanks for any reviews you can give. - Jim
https://www.jamcosuspension.com/product ... -pbb6566tb
Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
Moderator: redstangbob
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
It looks Very similar to the setup that I ended up putting together. I would be curious to see what master cylinder it uses, because that would make all the difference. find the thread that I made and look it over.
I'm not super excited about the 7" booster, but the would give you plenty of clearance with any valve cover.
I'm not super excited about the 7" booster, but the would give you plenty of clearance with any valve cover.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
I can see from your thread that you went through quite a process to arrive at your setup. Thanks for sharing that info.dgalietti wrote: ↑Thu Oct 29, 2020 7:11 pm It looks Very similar to the setup that I ended up putting together. I would be curious to see what master cylinder it uses, because that would make all the difference. find the thread that I made and look it over.
I'm not super excited about the 7" booster, but the would give you plenty of clearance with any valve cover.
Are your aftermarket valve covers significantly taller than stock? And how much smaller is your booster than original? Your clearance between the two looks very close...but that may just be an optical illusion. I chose Ansen Valve covers because they should seal much better than my originals, and have the T-Bird logo on them. According to Ansen, mine are the "short" version, but I was disappointed to find out today that they still conflict with the original booster...but just barely. I think there may be a way to get it to fit (it could be only an installation clearance issue rather than a parts-in-place clearance issue, if that makes any sense.) I was going to get the booster rebuilt anyway, but then I figured, Why not go ahead and get a dual reservoir conversion, while I'm at it?
I don't suppose you've been able to try your setup on the road yet, have you? Looks like it will work great, regardless. Jamco says that they build them on an as-ordered basis, so it would take about 3-4 weeks to get to me, but I'm guessing more like 7-8 weeks. I'm willing to wait.....if it works well.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
I didn't measure the diameters, but the new 8" booster I would say is at least an inch smaller than the old one.
The new valve covers I got are quite a bit taller than the old ones that I took off. I needed them to clear the roller rockers. I don't think your valve covers will be a problem.
They are fairly close. the bracket is slotted, so it adjusts up and down, so I can gain some clearance by adjusting it up. It was not bolted down in the pics that I took. I was just checking for clearance.
Unfortunately I haven't gotten it all back together yet. I'm replacing the floor pans and entire trunk floor which precedes me getting the fuel lines, brake lines, and fuel tank in.. and also getting it to an exhaust shop.. since I can't break it in with open headers with the sniper EFI.
I think I would be comfortable trying the JAMCO system out. I used them for my lowering springs and they are a great company. If the braking effort is too much and you have the clearance, then you could later swap for an 8" booster.
My other advice is to remove your entire pedal assembly, disassemble it, clean it up, and lubricate it. You will probably be surprised by how much it binds up and how much noise it makes.
The new valve covers I got are quite a bit taller than the old ones that I took off. I needed them to clear the roller rockers. I don't think your valve covers will be a problem.
They are fairly close. the bracket is slotted, so it adjusts up and down, so I can gain some clearance by adjusting it up. It was not bolted down in the pics that I took. I was just checking for clearance.
Unfortunately I haven't gotten it all back together yet. I'm replacing the floor pans and entire trunk floor which precedes me getting the fuel lines, brake lines, and fuel tank in.. and also getting it to an exhaust shop.. since I can't break it in with open headers with the sniper EFI.
I think I would be comfortable trying the JAMCO system out. I used them for my lowering springs and they are a great company. If the braking effort is too much and you have the clearance, then you could later swap for an 8" booster.
My other advice is to remove your entire pedal assembly, disassemble it, clean it up, and lubricate it. You will probably be surprised by how much it binds up and how much noise it makes.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
What I like about your set up is that it (the mounting of the booster on the bracket) is adjustable. I wasn't sure how critical the geometry of the rod going into the booster from the pedal was or wasn't, but if they make slotted brackets to adjust for clearance, I'm guessing the geometry probably isn't quite the issue that I though it might be.
BTW, slotting the openings on the original bracket was how I figured I might be able to mount the original booster back in place without clearance issues: install the booster studs into the bracket high in the slots, then push the booster rearward until it's mating surface contacts the bracket...then the booster would (hopefully) be rearward enough to drop to it's original mounting position (at the bottom of the slot) because the front face of the booster should be far enough behind the valve cover. I may experiment and see if this can happen just for the heck if it. As I said before, I think it's "installation" clearance that's the issue rather than "parts-in-place" clearance, but it would be a tight-ish fit nevertheless.
I also like that your system is a heck of a lot less expensive than the $479 for the Jamco unit. BTW, I presume you are still able to use the pedal linkage mounted brake light switch with your modification?
BTW, slotting the openings on the original bracket was how I figured I might be able to mount the original booster back in place without clearance issues: install the booster studs into the bracket high in the slots, then push the booster rearward until it's mating surface contacts the bracket...then the booster would (hopefully) be rearward enough to drop to it's original mounting position (at the bottom of the slot) because the front face of the booster should be far enough behind the valve cover. I may experiment and see if this can happen just for the heck if it. As I said before, I think it's "installation" clearance that's the issue rather than "parts-in-place" clearance, but it would be a tight-ish fit nevertheless.
I also like that your system is a heck of a lot less expensive than the $479 for the Jamco unit. BTW, I presume you are still able to use the pedal linkage mounted brake light switch with your modification?
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
Yes, The brake light switch mounts the same.
As far as the geometry is concerned, I don't think it is an issue at all. The brake pedal itself is the lever which is applying pressure the the pushrod going to the booster. As long as you aren't changing anything with the brake pedal it should apply the same amount of force. The main concern I had was with pedal travel, resting position, clearance, and making sure nothing binds up anywhere within the full range of travel.
As you can see in a few of my pics I took the entire assembly out from pedal to master cylinder and made sure that the pedal travel was exactly the same. I also checked to make sure everything moved freely without binding up anywhere. You can see that I used masking tape on the bracket to make sure that the resting pedal position was identical between the old and new setup.
The universal boosters usually come with an extra long threaded pushrod, so you will have to mock it up and then cut it down to size. It is much easier with the whole assembly out of the car.
I would be willing to bet that the bracket that comes with the Jamco kit is exactly the same as the one I got or at least very similar. It should be slotted too.
I don't think the pushrod on our stock boosters are adjustable. So slotting the old bracket will probably be out. You could however try to use your old bracket with a universal master cyl, and one of the master cylinders that will fit. The bolt pattern is very similar, but the holes will have to be cut closer to the center.
As far as the geometry is concerned, I don't think it is an issue at all. The brake pedal itself is the lever which is applying pressure the the pushrod going to the booster. As long as you aren't changing anything with the brake pedal it should apply the same amount of force. The main concern I had was with pedal travel, resting position, clearance, and making sure nothing binds up anywhere within the full range of travel.
As you can see in a few of my pics I took the entire assembly out from pedal to master cylinder and made sure that the pedal travel was exactly the same. I also checked to make sure everything moved freely without binding up anywhere. You can see that I used masking tape on the bracket to make sure that the resting pedal position was identical between the old and new setup.
The universal boosters usually come with an extra long threaded pushrod, so you will have to mock it up and then cut it down to size. It is much easier with the whole assembly out of the car.
I would be willing to bet that the bracket that comes with the Jamco kit is exactly the same as the one I got or at least very similar. It should be slotted too.
I don't think the pushrod on our stock boosters are adjustable. So slotting the old bracket will probably be out. You could however try to use your old bracket with a universal master cyl, and one of the master cylinders that will fit. The bolt pattern is very similar, but the holes will have to be cut closer to the center.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
By no means a brake expert but I seem to remember reading that 8" booster was the smallest size that should be used. Having said that it was about 8 years ago and I can't remember if that was for single or dual diaphragm boosters.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
Missing from this discussion is the MC bore size. I looked at the Jamco ad maybe not long enough, I couldn’t see the bore size of the master. Some folks have installed a 1 1/8” bore unit and noticed a better response than the original Mustang 1” duals we’ve been using. I’m not there yet in the middle of my resto. Just adding to the confusion 
Paul
VTCI 12014
Registry 45122
'64 Landau HT
"Beer, now there's a temporary solution!" ~Homer Simpson
VTCI 12014
Registry 45122
'64 Landau HT
"Beer, now there's a temporary solution!" ~Homer Simpson
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
OK, so I'm FINALLY back on the brake stuff. We had recurring spates of unseasonably warm weather in the midwest during November and December, so it was a good time to get interior panels cleaned off, prepped and repainted, as well as recoloring the fabric. I also got my grungy trunk surfaces scraped, patched, prepped and recoated with POR 15 and a suitable protective top coat. When it's warm I can do this stuff outside or at least keep the garage door open...(less complaints about fumes.)
Anyway, I have the new valve covers on and I like them. They're staying. Unfortunately, it appears that the original booster will definitely not work with the new covers as far as dimensional fit. I was leaving that option open for a 10% possibility of staying with a single res. MC. So it's basically a choice between the JAMCO setup and Mr. Galietti's proposed set up. In light of that, I thought I'd check and see if anyone has yet had a chance to install and road test Mr. Galietti's option in the 2 -1/2 months since I last posted on this subject? I didn't see any updates from him on his thread.
I much prefer his option because it looks like solid components and is a fraction of the cost of the JAMCO... but I'm not very good at putting my faith in the unknown. One of the reasons I like having original-ish old cars is I'm not entirely comfortable re-engineering factory stuff. That's me. I'll do it on occasion (I have a dual res. MC on my "54 Ford that I put on several years ago) but tend to leave the actual engineering of it to others. Left to my own devices, I tend towards failure.
A couple of folks have expressed varying degrees of hesitance with the 7" booster on the JAMCO unit, though. I should mention that the JAMCO ad says it's 7" booster is a "dual diaphram." What does that mean? And what difference would it make? Thanks.
Anyway, I have the new valve covers on and I like them. They're staying. Unfortunately, it appears that the original booster will definitely not work with the new covers as far as dimensional fit. I was leaving that option open for a 10% possibility of staying with a single res. MC. So it's basically a choice between the JAMCO setup and Mr. Galietti's proposed set up. In light of that, I thought I'd check and see if anyone has yet had a chance to install and road test Mr. Galietti's option in the 2 -1/2 months since I last posted on this subject? I didn't see any updates from him on his thread.
I much prefer his option because it looks like solid components and is a fraction of the cost of the JAMCO... but I'm not very good at putting my faith in the unknown. One of the reasons I like having original-ish old cars is I'm not entirely comfortable re-engineering factory stuff. That's me. I'll do it on occasion (I have a dual res. MC on my "54 Ford that I put on several years ago) but tend to leave the actual engineering of it to others. Left to my own devices, I tend towards failure.
A couple of folks have expressed varying degrees of hesitance with the 7" booster on the JAMCO unit, though. I should mention that the JAMCO ad says it's 7" booster is a "dual diaphram." What does that mean? And what difference would it make? Thanks.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
Unfortunately project creep has got me again... so I still haven't tested. When I was working on my trunk pan and sheetmetal I decided to do my entire rear end and add disc brakes.. which is now done.
Strangely the thing that is holding me up now is that I can't find a reasonably priced bottle of argon mix gas for my mig welder so I can weld in the floor pans and trunk metal. Then I could reassemble and drive the naked bird down the street and dial in the brakes.
I have my reservations as well... and I suppose something could come up and I will have to rethink it all, but I'm pretty sure I've got all my bases covered.
the dual diaphragm boosters have an extra diaphragm inside to provide much greater braking assistance without increasing the diameter of the booster.
An 8" dual diaphragm booster has more surface area and is more effective than an 11" single diaphragm booster.
Strangely the thing that is holding me up now is that I can't find a reasonably priced bottle of argon mix gas for my mig welder so I can weld in the floor pans and trunk metal. Then I could reassemble and drive the naked bird down the street and dial in the brakes.
I have my reservations as well... and I suppose something could come up and I will have to rethink it all, but I'm pretty sure I've got all my bases covered.
the dual diaphragm boosters have an extra diaphragm inside to provide much greater braking assistance without increasing the diameter of the booster.
An 8" dual diaphragm booster has more surface area and is more effective than an 11" single diaphragm booster.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
Thanks for the explanation. Time to ponder some more. Sorry you encountered some delays. I've had similar frustrations.dgalietti wrote: ↑Mon Jan 18, 2021 5:45 pm the dual diaphragm boosters have an extra diaphragm inside to provide much greater braking assistance without increasing the diameter of the booster.
An 8" dual diaphragm booster has more surface area and is more effective than an 11" single diaphragm booster.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
Found another complete package option for the '65 Thunderbird from a place called ABS Power Brake. To my eye, it looks exactly the same as the Jamco kit, but costs about $100 less, when you take into account the Jamco upcharge for the proportioning valve (for some reason.)
I'll probably end up ordering this one. And I'll let you know what I think. Here's the link, but you need to go to page 100 in the online catalog.
http://www.abspowerbrake.com/maincatalog_frameset.html
I'll probably end up ordering this one. And I'll let you know what I think. Here's the link, but you need to go to page 100 in the online catalog.
http://www.abspowerbrake.com/maincatalog_frameset.html
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
The ABS system has been around for a while. I think I referenced it a few times but obviously have lost track on what I have looked at over the years. There have been so many. Not sure if anyone has used it or not but it does look like a good unit and ABS seem to know there brake stuff.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
I notice their 63-64 kit shows that it has a 8" booster. I wonder if they have a reason for that and if they would substitute? Dimensionally everything is exactly the same for the 64-66.
Re: Any experience with the Jamco Brake MC and booster conversion?
Well...I went ahead and ordered the ABS system. It was $399 with the correct proportioning valve, and that didn't seem so outrageous. The Jamco unit was about $520 with the disc/drum proportioning valve, and that just seemed a little expensive. I talked with the folks at ABS, and they were very familiar with the particulars, like it not interfering with the existing shock tower braces and such.
Both the Jamco and ABS systems specify a 7" dual diaphragm booster, so that makes me a little more confident that such a booster will function adequately. I guess I'll find out. ABS is bit more focused on brakes than Jamco, and the reviews for the company online were pretty good, though I saw no reviews for that exact application. Includes the bracket. Looks like it uses their pushrod, so hopefully that will interface with the factory brake light switch OK. Hopefully I'll have it next week or the week after, so I'll keep you updated.
Both the Jamco and ABS systems specify a 7" dual diaphragm booster, so that makes me a little more confident that such a booster will function adequately. I guess I'll find out. ABS is bit more focused on brakes than Jamco, and the reviews for the company online were pretty good, though I saw no reviews for that exact application. Includes the bracket. Looks like it uses their pushrod, so hopefully that will interface with the factory brake light switch OK. Hopefully I'll have it next week or the week after, so I'll keep you updated.