Engine wires.

[Karl]

G'day.
Looking for some Photo's / information.
I have always thought that my 63 Bird had air con as standard. The reason behind this thought is, in the dash there is all the necessary items for the air con. The engine that was in the car when I purchased it was a 66 engine so I reconditioned a 63 engine to keep it original as possible. So now I am about to fit as close as possible to original the rest of the air condition parts.

At the same time I am going to replace the wires that go to the engine for the temp sender, oil pressure and coil. In looking at those wires I noticed that there is no brown wire to run the clutch for the air conditioner pump. I did install a brown wire to the switch that is in the dash when I had the dash out nearly 10 years ago and run that to inside the engine bay to be connected at a later date. I should thought then how come the car does not have the brown wire if the dash was original. So now I think maybe the dash is from another car that had air con.

Anyway would somebody have a photo's or know of the wiring loom that runs along the drivers side cylinder head to feed the above items and the compressor clutch and if the brown wire is in that part of the loom or runs separate.

Many thanks, and all the best for the coming year.
Karl.

[Jim Wulf]

G'Day Karl,

I just started the the process of restoring the engine wiring harness on my '63 convertible and here's what I see. The oil pressure wire (white-red) and the temp wire (red-white), and the two brake switch wires (green-red, and green) split from the main tape covered loom and run for @15inches together wrapped in tape. The OP and temp wires then split off from the brake switch wires at that point and run through three of the cowl wiring retainer clips and then down along the left valve cover to the front of the engine, where they again split off to their respective components, each in their own fabric loom. After splitting off, the brake switch wires run in their own fabric loom in the same three cowl retainer clips and then continue under the left cowl brace, secured with two more retainer clips, to the switch on the master cylinder. Interestingly, on my very late '63 convertible, all of these retainer clips are plastic like the '64 style clips instead of the rubber coated metal retainer clips I've always found in earlier 61-63 cars.

The heavy coil wire (red-white) runs in its own fabric loom after it leaves the main taped harness, travels up the firewall, then through the three cowl retainer clips, and then along the valve cover to the coil.

The brown AC wire, which isn't pictured below, exits the firewall separately through a tapered grommet to the left of the main wiring harness plug, travels up the firewall, through the same three cowl retainer clips, and then runs along the valve cover where it ends in a female terminal plug that connects to the AC brush wire's male terminal. This wire also has its own fabric loom covering after exiting the firewall.

So there are three separate looms running along the valve cover, each encased in it's own fabric loom, and secured to the inner valve cover bolts with the appropriate 378041-S-100 wiring clips. I'm going to make a guess that these wire clips were enlarged in '63 to more easily accomodate all three fabric looms. The corresponding '62 clips 356640-S100, were much smaller.

[Karl]

Thank you very much Jim, very much appreciated.
With your information and going back to the Electrical assembly Manual I can now see the two separate looms. Although the Assembly manual doesn't show the brown wire.

Going on what you say about the brown wire coming through a separate hole I am back to thinking my car did come with air con and the dash is the original one. The wire somewhere in its life got cut off.
I can now understand that the air con wire would have a separate loom as this was a extra so the wire wouldn't be incorporated in the standard loom.

As for my wires that lay on the engine somebody has taped them all together as the original outer covering has failed.

So now I have begun the process of making new wires up and then making up the loom to splice into the original loom somewhere behind the booster. I have also looked at new clips from A.M.K.to hold the wires to the valve cover bolts. My car was built in Dec 62 so I would think that the clips would be the metal with rubber covering. You say the car that you are working on has the 64 style clip on it. Do you know when this started?

Thank you very much.
Karl.

P.S. In the photo that you posted you have tape on each of the wire to say where they go. Looking at the image the wire that goes to the coil looks like it says "Oil" but it has a ring terminal end on it, I thought that's not right but then I realized I can't see the letter "C". How a photo can be deceiving.

[Alan H. Tast]

Karl: I can vouch for Jim's observation of the A/C wire being separate and having a fabric loom cover from the October '62-build cars I have, along with the fabric conduit over them at the valve covers for the oil/water/coil wire bundle. You may not be seeing the A/C compressor wire against the inboard side of the the valve cover in one view of the Electrical Assembly Manual, but I would suspect it may be showing up in the A/C-specific illustrations, including the firewall penetration.

Jim: When you get a chance, shoot me info on what you're finding on your late-build '63 and how it differs from earlier ones so I can document for the '61-'63 OFS revisions. I have been working on updating/upgrading photos in it over the past few weeks, and was actually working on getting the upholstery sample pages updated last night to show all fabric/vinyl/leather swatches I have from color-upholstery albums to match in format what we're going to release for the '64-'66 OFS update.

[Jim Wulf]

Thank you very much Jim, very much appreciated.
With your information and going back to the Electrical assembly Manual I can now see the two separate looms. Although the Assembly manual doesn't show the brown wire.

Going on what you say about the brown wire coming through a separate hole I am back to thinking my car did come with air con and the dash is the original one. The wire somewhere in its life got cut off.
I can now understand that the air con wire would have a separate loom as this was a extra so the wire wouldn't be incorporated in the standard loom.

As for my wires that lay on the engine somebody has taped them all together as the original outer covering has failed.

Original wires 1.jpg
Original wires 2.jpg
Original wires 3.jpg

So now I have begun the process of making new wires up and then making up the loom to splice into the original loom somewhere behind the booster. I have also looked at new clips from A.M.K.to hold the wires to the valve cover bolts. My car was built in Dec 62 so I would think that the clips would be the metal with rubber covering. You say the car that you are working on has the 64 style clip on it. Do you know when this started?
New wires.jpg

Thank you very much.
Karl.

P.S. In the photo that you posted you have tape on each of the wire to say where they go. Looking at the image the wire that goes to the coil looks like it says "Oil" but it has a ring terminal end on it, I thought that's not right but then I realized I can't see the letter "C". How a photo can be deceiving.

Karl,

The valve cover clips and the cowl retainer clips are two different animals. Your cowl retainer clips would be the metal clip with rubber coating. They are not available from AMK, although I may have some extras if you need them. The large valve cover clip, used on all 63's is not available from anyone either. I always make my own using an original as a model, and with your excellent fabrication skills it would be easy for to do the same. I'll come up with some photos and dimensions for you.

[Jim Wulf]

Karl: I can vouch for Jim's observation of the A/C wire being separate and having a fabric loom cover from the October '62-build cars I have, along with the fabric conduit over them at the valve covers for the oil/water/coil wire bundle. You may not be seeing the A/C compressor wire against the inboard side of the the valve cover in one view of the Electrical Assembly Manual, but I would suspect it may be showing up in the A/C-specific illustrations, including the firewall penetration.

Jim: When you get a chance, shoot me info on what you're finding on your late-build '63 and how it differs from earlier ones so I can document for the '61-'63 OFS revisions. I have been working on updating/upgrading photos in it over the past few weeks, and was actually working on getting the upholstery sample pages updated last night to show all fabric/vinyl/leather swatches I have from color-upholstery albums to match in format what we're going to release for the '64-'66 OFS update.

The clips are the only difference I have noticed so far, but I took this car apart 25 years ago when I wasn't nearly as familiar with these cars. As I put thing back together in the next 6 months, I imagine I'll probably come up with other differences.

[Karl]

Thanks Jim the photo's and dimensions off both of the clips ( cowl and valve cover) would be appreciated. as all of mine are missing I will fabricate my own. Could you also send a photo and dimensions of the clip that is in the drivers side corner that holds the main loom to the cowl, that one is also missing but there is just a generic plastic one to hold the loom inplace. In the electrical assy manual that one is on page E3-4100-1, number 18, part #378043.

I used a product called plasti dip for some other clips that I made. I worked out ok but I had to dip them a number of times to obtain a thick coating.
I might try melting some plastic, the same stuff that I use for the terminal ends and see how they turn out.
Karl.

Tonight Jim I had a look at my wiring harness on the car. unlike yours that has 2 main looms mine has only one. Weather this is from factory or somebody has taped it up I am not sure.
I also have a spare loom which I purchased in 2014 for a spare and for the unique alternator plug on that end. I purchased it as a 1963 one but when I received it and gave it a closer inspection it was a 1964 loom, different colour wires.
The thing with the loom on the car is the alternator wires go under the radiator but the 64 one goes over the top of the radiator.

Both have only one main loom coming out of the firewall. There are two plugs that plug into the firewall and for all intense and purpose one could make two main looms out of them both the same as you have.
Do you think this could be one of those running changes that Ford made? My build date is 28th of Dec 62.

Maybe in the early 63's there were two looms out of the firewall which then changed to one loom somewhere near December, then later they changed the alternator wires to over the top of the radiator rather than under - what are you views?
Karl.

[Jim Wulf]

Thanks Jim the photo's and dimensions off both of the clips ( cowl and valve cover) would be appreciated. as all of mine are missing I will fabricate my own. Could you also send a photo and dimensions of the clip that is in the drivers side corner that holds the main loom to the cowl, that one is also missing but there is just a generic plastic one to hold the loom inplace. In the electrical assy manual that one is on page E3-4100-1, number 18, part #378043.

I used a product called plasti dip for some other clips that I made. I worked out ok but I had to dip them a number of times to obtain a thick coating.
I might try melting some plastic, the same stuff that I use for the terminal ends and see how they turn out.
Karl.

Tonight Jim I had a look at my wiring harness on the car. unlike yours that has 2 main looms mine has only one. Weather this is from factory or somebody has taped it up I am not sure.
I also have a spare loom which I purchased in 2014 for a spare and for the unique alternator plug on that end. I purchased it as a 1963 one but when I received it and gave it a closer inspection it was a 1964 loom, different colour wires.
The thing with the loom on the car is the alternator wires go under the radiator but the 64 one goes over the top of the radiator.

Both have only one main loom coming out of the firewall. There are two plugs that plug into the firewall and for all intense and purpose one could make two main looms out of them both the same as you have.
Do you think this could be one of those running changes that Ford made? My build date is 28th of Dec 62.

Maybe in the early 63's there were two looms out of the firewall which then changed to one loom somewhere near December, then later they changed the alternator wires to over the top of the radiator rather than under - what are you views?
Karl.

Karl,

Your questions:

1. I'll post photos with ruler dimensions of the clips after this post. I need to take some photos first.

2. I think the large clip that secures the main loom to the cowl is actually plastic, not the metal clip as shown in the assembly manual, perhaps one of those undocumented changes Ford made after the manual was printed. I'm including a link to a large photo album of a largely unmolested '63 hardtop with a built date of 11A that has a plastic clip in that spot that I'm 99% certain is original to the car. I don't have any metal clips in my collection that correspond to that shown in the manual, and don't recall ever seeing one in all the parts cars I've dismantled. As far as I could tell, about the only original items that were ever changed on this car were the heater hoses, so this car is a treasure trove of originality.

3. I also use Plasti Dip, with a great deal of success. I found that the thickness of the material really alters the application characteristics. If it's too thin, it requires several coats. Too thick and it doesn't drip off easily enough. If it's too thin, I let the can sit open until enough of the solvent has flashed off just enough to achieve a nice dippable consistency. If it's just right, two applications will be enough to produce a nice coating. I spin the part around slowly by hand to achieve an even coating which usually takes 4-5 minutes until the material forms a skin and stops dripping. It's a bit tedious, but I'll just read a book on my phone as I'm doing it. If the material is too thick, it can be thinned with toulene.

4. This '63 hardtop also has a starter/alternator loom that is routed under the radiator like my 63 CV. I guess Ford decided that for this loom, the more direct route was preferable to the earlier routing over the radiator. So the change took place sometime between your car's build date of 28th of Dec 62 and this car's build date of 11th of January 63. Photos of this 63's loom routing under the radiator are shown in the album as well. Here is the link, which expires in 30 days, so you, and anyone else that's interested, should download these pictures for future reference:

https://share.icloud.com/photos/02deL6c ... kglLcD4cvQ

5. Since my CV is such a late car, I see no evidence that the alternator wiring was ever changed back to over the radiator in '63. A lot of wire and hose routing changed in '64.

[Alan H. Tast]

Early 63s had a single loom running over the left inner front fender and had the alternator wiring branch off of it after crossing in front of the radiator; the voltage regulator wiring-plug came out of the main loom before crossing the radiator opening. After the beginning of January '63 the main loom was split in two and the separate regulator alternator loom that crossed along the bottom of the radiator opening came into play. If you have the MPC you should be able to find the looms and customer dates. I'd do a deeper dive into the date/changeover thing for OFS research purposes (and I probably already did), but 'duty calls' over the next few weeks with a Scoop deadline and 'real job' commitments, along with a side trip to the Phoenix area next weekend for my FIL's 90th birthday party.

[Jim Wulf]

Karl,

Here's some photos of the valve cover clips - these are originals in the photos - and are easy to make. Note the slightly bent corners near the bolt hole.

[Jim Wulf]

The cowl clips are more complicated, even more so because they're made from spring steel. I have extras of the cowl clips if you decide you want them. I'm actually using the steel cowl clips on my late '63 CV because the original '64 style plastic clips had become brittle and most of them broke.

[Karl]

G'day Jim.
Thanks for both lots of the photo's.
I have downloaded the photo's that you supplied the link with. A lot of information there. That will help me with a lot of other areas as well.

A friend of mine had a 63 hard top some time ago and I went to have a look at it. He said that there wasn't much rust in it and he wanted to know if I wanted to buy it as at the time I was looking for some parts.
When I saw the car, it was a Landau and had a vinyl roof. The car was full of rust, it was that bad that both front wheels would not turn as the drums and everything in there were completely seized. That's when he told me it had been sitting under a tree for the last 20 years.
If I had somewhere to store it to disassemble it to keep all the good parts I probably would of bought it as some of the parts would of been good.
The build date was the 8th of Dec which is 20 days prior to mine.

To me it seemed somewhat original, it had the upper alternator shield on it still and other small items so it was in regards to originality better than mine. I took a few photo's, would you be interested in these? Maybe you might see something that could clarify something.
Karl.