OEM or Concours Heater Hoses

[gnorwood2]

Hello everyone. This is my first post and need help or advise with my 1966 Ford Thunderbird. Maybe there's already a post on this, so I apologize upfront. However, I need to replace the heater hoses and want to make sure I go back with the OE or Concours heater hoses. My T-Bird has a 428 and has AC, so I need both 5/8 and 3/4 heater hoses. I have seen many vendors out there just selling the solid black or ones that have the white stripe on them and I am not sure. Brands out there are Gates, Continental, AC Delco, Dayco, etc. I Googled to see if Motocraft sold them as well and couldn't find them. The car only has 31K miles and its all original, but someone put these awful red color heater hoses on and now they're shot and it looks like they tried to use one size, I believe 3/4, for the whole system. I just want to go back with the OE Concours heater hoses and use the tower style clamps. Thank you everyone for their posts and I have learned a lot from the posts that I already have seen.

[jtschug]

There is a picture on page 218 of the William Wonder book credited to Alan Tast. It is in black and white (Perhaps Alan has the original in color), but it clearly shows a stripe on the heater hoses. Ford had white stripe and yellow stripe hoses in the 1960s, but I think this should be a white stripe. I'm pretty sure I've read somewhere the hoses should have some ribs running along them, but I've looked at my 2002 Concours manual and I couldn't find that bit of information.

Marti Auto Works sells reproduction heater hoses for Mustangs, maybe they have some bulk material in the right sizes. I tried searching their website, but came up short. For something like this, if you can't find it at one of the T-bird vendors: Pat Wilson, Birdnest, ect. then move on to the Mustang vendors. I like National Parts Depot, but there are a million of them. I'm not sure if any of the Mustangs used 3/4" hose back in 1966, but if they did, you would certainly be able to get some. There are a lot more concours correct Mustangs than Thunderbirds.

Speaking of the concours manual, I can't seem to find the VTCI store. Where can I buy a new one?

[Scott6T6]

'66 Thunderbird's typically had a 1/4" wide YELLOW stripe on the 5/8" heater hoses. The 3/4" heater hose sections used on cars equipped with A/C likely had no stripes. All heater hoses used on Fords of that era had a series of grooves/ribs running lengthwise on the surface of the hose. The pattern/number of those grooves & ribs were used to identify the manufacturer the hose. Cars with standard heaters were fitted with 5/8" heater hose, while those cars equipped with optional A/C used both 5/8" and 3/4" heater hoses.

In the first photo you can see the grooves/ribbing as well as the yellow ink stripe on an original factory 5/8" heater hose that is still present on a very low mile, unrestored '66 Thunderbird owned by a friend of mine. This car has no A/C.
The second photo below shows an original factory yellow striped heater hose on a 19,000 actual mile '66 Thunderbird without A/C.
The third photo shows the yellow striped heater hoses on my 22,250 mile, '66 survivor. My car does not have A/C
In the fourth photo, you can see the factory installed heater outlet hose with a yellow stripe as well as the HT - 240 - PUMP - OUT markings in white also found on my friends '66 Standard Hardtop (no A/C).
I've been documenting the original heater hoses on '64 - '66 Thunderbird's for well over four decades and yet I've never come across a car with factory A/C that had the factory 3/4" heater hoses still in place. As you can imagine, finding any nearly 60-year-old car today that still has the factory installed heater hoses in place is extremely rare.

I also need to mention in 1966 Wixom used worm gear clamps on all of the heater hoses. The only exception was the water pump bypass hose that was secured with tower clamps. The hose clamps are illustrated along with the part numbers in the 1966 FORD PRODUCTS ENGINE EQUIPMENT ASSEMBLY MANUAL. Worm gear clamps were used on the radiator hoses as well.

As jtschug already mentioned, Marti Auto Works does have a reproduction yellow striped heater hose available. If you call them and explain you have a '66 Thunderbird with a 428 and A/C, they can supply you with the heater hoses you need. Forget about getting the correct heater hoses from the Thunderbird parts vendors, they don't carry them! Go figure?
Scott

[gnorwood2]

Thank you jtschug and Scott for the great information!! I will contact Marti Auto Works to buy the yellow stripped heater hose and use the worm gear clamps and return the tower clamps to Thunderbird Specialties. Thank you all again for the great information!!

[Scott6T6]

You're welcome gnorwood2 and welcome to this forum!

Look closely at the worm gear clamps presently on your engine. Since your Thunderbird only has 31,000 miles on it, most of those hose clamps could very well be the factory installed ones. I have seen this many times over the years on low mile cars and I've removed many of those factory clamps from cars in salvage yards. Those worm gear clamps were stainless steel and they're reuseable. Often when heater and radiator hoses got replaced, the clamps were reused.

The upper/lower radiator hoses and the two transmission cooler flex hose sections were secured with MURRAY GOLD SEAL brand worm gear clamps at the Wixom Assembly Plant.

The heater hoses were fastened with WITTEK brand worm gear clamps.

The short water pump bypass hose was secured with two WITTEK tower clamps. This water pump by-pass hose and the two tower clamps were painted engine color (in your case Ford Corporate Blue) because they were in place with the water pump installed when the engines were painted when new.

All of the hoses on my engine are secured with the period correct clamps that Wixom used!

Scott

[RAVEN]

ALSO if Marti can not send the ribbed hose material, check with your local """GM""" retro parts supplier. It is a little known fact that the repop GM suppliers sell ribbed hoses, minus the yellow or white paint line but a little finess and you can replicate that stripe.

Just a little side bar info, if anyone is interested. How I know? I bought some hose for my car when I restored it, with the ribbing.

[Alan H. Tast]

ALSO if Marti can not send the ribbed hose material, check with your local """GM""" retro parts supplier. It is a little known fact that the repop GM suppliers sell ribbed hoses, minus the yellow or white paint line but a little finess and you can replicate that stripe.

Just a little side bar info, if anyone is interested. How I know? I bought some hose for my car when I restored it, with the ribbing.

To add to this, typically the 5/8" hose has a stripe on it: in fact, the factory parts catalogs from the period noted the white identification stripe detail to distinguish it as heater hose versus other applications like power steering or other hoses that would carry petroleum products that would degrade a heater hose. The 3/4" hose, on the other hand, didn't get an identification stripe: the ribs on the hose served as the identification for the inside diameter for the hose as they're ribbed differently than the 5/8" hoses. Like raven, I ended up going through a parts house that specialized in Novas-Chevelles-Camaros for my reproduction 3/4" hose, but got my 5/8" white-striped hose from AMK products or one of the Mustang parts houses like National Parts Depot or Scott Drake Reproductions (and there are other places out there).

[RAVEN]

Nice to know that there are sources to be found to get the odds and ends.

[gnorwood2]

Thank you again Scott for great information!! I was able to speak Marti Works and they were great to work with. They do have the ribbed heater hoses and they have a machine that prints out the yellow stripe on it, which is great. Marti Works is in process of making my heater hoses as we speak. They were kind of pricy, but it will be concours. Also, Scott, thank you for the great information on the type of worm and tower clamps as they're used for the specific hoses. Unfortunately, when the previous owner replace the heater hoses, he replaced the original clamps with Gates worm gear clamps, so I don't have the original ones. However, I was able to purchase the the reproduction WITTEK tower clamps and will research in were I can buy the reproduction/concours worm gear clamps.

[gnorwood2]

Thank you Allen and Raven for your information as well!! I am so thankful for all the input!!

[Scott6T6]

Well, it's unfortunate that a previous owner discarded those factory clamps that were on your heater hoses. That will just make your task more difficult and costly to locate those correct heater hose clamps, but it's certainly possible if you're so inclined.

The factory installed heater hose clamps on a '66 Thunderbird were Wittek Sure-Tite # 12, worm gear clamps. WITTEK MFG CO CHI USA and the patent # was stamped into the screw housing and Sure-Tite 12 was stamped into the band as you can see in the photos I attached.

I don't know if these Wittek worm gear clamps have been reproduced by anyone. I did see a few used original clamps on eBay, but they are very spendy.
No judge would give you a point deduction for having Gates worm gear clamps on your heater hoses simply because they wouldn't know the difference! However, if your personal goal is to make your '66 as close to original as possible, then you will want the Wittek hose clamps on your heater hoses.

Thunderbirds without optional A/C required 4 clamps to secure the heater hoses, while those cars equipped with A/C used 10 clamps.

Scott

[gnorwood2]

Thank you Scott6T6 for all the great information and pics to show the WITTEK #10 heater hose clamps!!

[Alan H. Tast]

Speaking of the concours manual, I can't seem to find the VTCI store. Where can I buy a new one?

The Club's Webmaster pulled down the VTCI Country Store pages earlier in October 2023, including ordering information for the Club's collection of Original Factory Specifications (OFS) manuals. I don't know all the reasons why, but one factor is that the person who was managing the Country Store and its Club merchandise has decided to step down after over a decade of handling orders. There has also been discussion about revamping the website and its pages, including the Country Store ones. Until a replacement person can be found and other arrangements made for transfer and cataloging of current inventory, it appears that the VTCI Country Store is in temporary hiatus.

Questions related to the Country Store and ordering of currently in-print OFS manuals should be initially directed to the Club President - contact information for Club officers/directors can be found at:
https://vintagethunderbirdclub.net/addresses.htm

In the case of 1961-1963 and 1964-1966 versions, we are in a prolonged revision period that has taken much longer than we originally planned for. Much of what you're seeing in the VTCI Forum dealing with original factory condition questions and responses are being addressed by members of the OFS Revision team, including Scott6T6, Jim Wulf, Raven and myself, along with a few other folks who've been helping out for over a decade-plus on what has turned into a monumental documentation effort for these generations.

[jtschug]

Speaking of the concours manual, I can't seem to find the VTCI store. Where can I buy a new one?

In the case of 1961-1963 and 1964-1966 versions, we are in a prolonged revision period that has taken much longer than we originally planned for. Much of what you're seeing in the VTCI Forum dealing with original factory condition questions and responses are being addressed by members of the OFS Revision team, including Scott6T6, Jim Wulf, Raven and myself, along with a few other folks who've been helping out for over a decade-plus on what has turned into a monumental documentation effort for these generations.

I'm waiting patiently. I will happily send my money to whomever once the new version is available. I appreciate all the work you guys are doing documenting these cars (even though I'm not great at keeping mine factory original).

[gnorwood2]

Thank you for the pics on the heater hose Scott6t6. Question, in those pics is the engine and valve cover the PPG 13358 or the Ford Grabber Blue 2302?