Carb Replacement

[bbogue]

I agree with Alan pretty much on this point. I’ve tried hard to make my old 4100 work with my somewhat performance enhanced engine. The more aggressive cam, bigger valves and headers meant changes, I think, even if the carb was perfect. And it took 3 major/minor overhauls to suit my engine. Finally getting out all the crud, flattening the warped surfaces, upsizing the jets and going to an earlier opening power valve have made it run much better. I tried for a while the hot air tube to the choke laying over the back of the head to slowly introduce warm air. It worked fair and I may go back to it but it didn’t look nice. So far I am impressed with the electric choke. My 2 cents.

Bill

[stevegintn]

I agree with Alan pretty much on this point. I’ve tried hard to make my old 4100 work with my somewhat performance enhanced engine. The more aggressive cam, bigger valves and headers meant changes, I think, even if the carb was perfect. And it took 3 major/minor overhauls to suit my engine. Finally getting out all the crud, flattening the warped surfaces, upsizing the jets and going to an earlier opening power valve have made it run much better. I tried for a while the hot air tube to the choke laying over the back of the head to slowly introduce warm air. It worked fair and I may go back to it but it didn’t look nice. So far I am impressed with the electric choke. My 2 cents.

Bill

Thanks, again, Bill (Bogue), and I applaud your tenacity, expertise, and patience (I have the tenacity, but short on the other two).

I am going to get the electric choke from Champion and see how it works for my car.

[ICON 1956]

She is running smooth, I just love that sound.

[GeoffInCarlsbad]

Well, as I said, a man's got to know his limitations, and I had already spent lots of time trying to make things right. I learned a lot, and feel if I really had the time and inclination, I could probably make it work..but I just don't have the time it really takes to go through the deep details in engineering (it's why I got into sales! LOL) So I bit the bullet, because it is more important that I have a safe vehicle to drive, than stay on the keep it original path. I did try, and did fail in that regard, but I have a vehicle that I can drive any time, without the fear of getting stranded in that intersection...which did happen and scared the poo out of my family...I swore I would not let that happen again.

I am keeping everything so that one day if I let her go, any buyer can have these parts....it's just a personal choice.

Whatever you decide, it will be the right decision.

[stevegintn]

Well, as I said, a man's got to know his limitations, and I had already spent lots of time trying to make things right. I learned a lot, and feel if I really had the time and inclination, I could probably make it work..but I just don't have the time it really takes to go through the deep details in engineering (it's why I got into sales! LOL) So I bit the bullet, because it is more important that I have a safe vehicle to drive, than stay on the keep it original path. I did try, and did fail in that regard, but I have a vehicle that I can drive any time, without the fear of getting stranded in that intersection...which did happen and scared the poo out of my family...I swore I would not let that happen again.

I am keeping everything so that one day if I let her go, any buyer can have these parts....it's just a personal choice.

Whatever you decide, it will be the right decision.

Thanks, again, Geoff - I can totally relate (esp about the time). I'm an old shade-tree guy - never rebuilt a carb larger than one off a push-mower. Never used a vacuum gauge or a voltmeter. I'm not too old to learn, but at this point, I have more money than I do time or patience.

So, as I said, I will first invest in the $50 electric choke and failing that, another $350 for a replacement carb.

[stevegintn]

P. S. I tweaked on the choke late yesterday, and finally got my car to start and run. Going out in a minute to see if it will do it, again.

But I'm still getting the electric choke

[stevegintn]

Just to close this out, I ordered the Electric Choke last week, it came Friday, and I installed it this morning.

The only 'tricky' part was sticking the lead 'b-b' into the vacuum port (behind the housing).

She was trying to start as soon as I turned the key, and after a few attempts, started right up. Then on a WARM engine, just TOUCH THE KEY and she starts. Now, I will try her on a COLD morning. Best $50 I spent in a LONG TIME!

Thanks for all the help!

P.S. Before anyone mentions it, AFTER I took the pic, I put the rubber cap on the heat inlet (at right in the pic)

[GeoffInCarlsbad]

Hey! Awesome news! Even better that it was a $50 fix instead of a $350 or more! I hope is works out in the long run for you as well! Good on you!

Regards,

~g

[stevegintn]

Hey! Awesome news! Even better that it was a $50 fix instead of a $350 or more! I hope is works out in the long run for you as well! Good on you!

Regards,

~g

Thanks, Geoff! - if it ever stops raining, I'll give her a road test

[ICON 1956]

interesting, I'm in the process of improving my carburetor function. She takes a little time to start.... Thanks for all the input.

[stevegintn]

She still may need a little adjustment? - had a couple backfires (which indicates too rich, right?

[stevegintn]

Bill Bogue, on a previous post I made, when I first started my choke adventure, you wrote:

"On my car, if choke set too lean at startup, I get backfire/cough. Seems to like choke plate nearly closed at startup. Had to mess with the linkage a bit until it was nearly closed at startup but open when warm. My engine has headers, like yours, different brand, so no hot air choke. I'm using an electric choke now from Champion Carburetors."

Can you tell me, what did you adjust on any linkage to resolve?

[bbogue]

Will do. May take a day or 2. Recovering from surgery. Moving slowly. Can’t wait to get back in my old ‘Bird!

Bill

[stevegintn]

Will do. May take a day or 2. Recovering from surgery. Moving slowly. Can’t wait to get back in my old ‘Bird!

Bill

Thanks, Bill and prayers for a speedy recovery!

[bbogue]

Steve,

I’m responding to your inquiry about my linkage adjustments. What I was referring to was the choke plate, bellcrank and cold idle adjustments. Mine are certainly not to spec but worked well enough before I put on the electric choke when the hot air tube was just lying against the rear of the head. Recall, I have headers so the OE hot air choke is not possible. Adjustment begins by propping open the throttle to free up the linkage. The choke plate adjustment instructions involve forcing to bend the tang on the end of an internal choke spring (not the bimetallic thermal spring) of the auto choke. I didn’t like that idea on a 57-year old carburetor so I did the best I could but then made a slight adjustment by loosening the 1/4” nut on the linkage clamp screw, adjusting and then snugging the nut. I also set the cold idle fairly low as I don’t wish to challenge the cast iron case crossmember in the transmission that has failed others when going into reverse. As noted, not to spec but it worked.

Without further linkage adjustments, but now with the electric choke installed, when the engine is cold, the choke is almost completely closed. After installation of the electric choke I had a little cough at startup several times. As I recall, a tweak leaner resolved that issue. That also might be why the choke is almost closed now at cold start, compared to when I was still using the hot air choke.

One thing that jumped out at me as a difference in our installations of the electric choke is the orientation. Yours looks rotated farther clockwise (lean direction, I think) than mine. This may be partly due to the loop I had to complete in the end of the bimetallic spring of the electric choke. It arrived with an incomplete loop on the end. Completing the loop shortens the spring but is necessary in my case since the bimetallic spring opens and closes the choke.

My carburetor/choke combination is a marriage of old and newer technologies. I like that I’m still able to use the original carburetor but my adjustments might not work for others. Because of my engine mods (headers, cam, roller rockers, bigger valves, lifters, open exhaust), I’ve also had to increase by 3 sizes the primary carburetor jets. That suggestion came from Ed Jenkins of the Ed’s Carburetor Forum. Ed loves the 4100 and has helped me a lot. My car runs, drives and stops pretty well and that’s what I want, an old, good looking Thunderbird that I can safely, reliably drive. My first car was a retired 62 Galaxie NC Highway Patrol car with high performance 390 engine. I think I’m pretty close to the power of my Galaxie in my TBird but it comes in earlier due to the cam change. I like what I have. Your results may vary.

Sorry to be so long. More therapy.

Good luck.

Bill

P.S. - As another part of my surgery recovery therapy, today I cranked up the old girl after 2 weeks of not having been started. It was slower starting than typical which is usually not more than a week between starts. Boy, she sounded sweeeeeet!!!