Water pump issues.
Moderator: ABQTBird
Water pump issues.
I had the engine machined some 12 months ago and my son has recently assembled the motor.
I fitted the motor to a engine test bench that I made 12 months ago and my intention is to test run the motor to make sure that everything is right before I pull a working engine out of my car. Just in case there is some problems.
Well I didn't have to wait long as when I started to fit the belt pulleys to the water pump, 1st problem.
It appears the the water pump that I have purchased (yes it is a aftermarket one, and yes I was told it would fit a 63 Thunderbird) has the webs in the casting to hold the nose of the water pump are larger than the pump that was on the motor when I purchased it.
The water pump that was on the motor has a casting mark of C4SE-8505-A and the engine has air conditioning, twin alternator belts and power steering. Everything seemed to be OK when I received the motor however it wasn't running. I take it that is was correct however.
With the aftermarket pump it has more webs on the pump than the original. These are on the nose of the water pump and they are thicker and larger.
As you see in the photos the pulley rubs on the webs.
The amount of interference is very minimal, only about 1/64" however this is enough. If you were to tighten the four bolts down it could cause damage to the pulleys or the pump.
Now this replacement water pump may fit a engine which does not have air conditioning, as the alternator doesn't need two belts and the pulley may be not as wide which will allow it to fit.
What I am trying to say is if you need to replace your water pump, try the pulleys on the pump before you fit the pump to the car. If the pulleys hit the water pump it will be a lot easier to fix the problem with the pump of the car.
Karl.
- Attachments
1963 Thunderbird Hardtop
Re: Water pump issues.
Hi Karl,
I had the same issue as you, god knows where my replacement was made but the pulley did rub. Was not a drama as I could file the webs down to make it fit which is what it looks like you have done. Only problem would be if someone did not check before installing in the car, so your point is well made, thanks.
Graeme
I had the same issue as you, god knows where my replacement was made but the pulley did rub. Was not a drama as I could file the webs down to make it fit which is what it looks like you have done. Only problem would be if someone did not check before installing in the car, so your point is well made, thanks.
Graeme
1962 Hardtop - in Melbourne, Australia
Re: Water pump issues.
I haven't done it yet but I will just hit it with a angle grinder and re-paint.
Karl.
Karl.
1963 Thunderbird Hardtop
Re: Water pump issues.
G'day.
Rectified the water pump issue. Moving forward.
I am looking at the bolts that hold the exhaust manifold on. I didn't have any manifolds on the engine when I purchased it so I have no bolts to compare with.
The MPC states that the part number is 20408-S7. They are a 3/8"-16 x 1 and 1/8" long hex head bolt. (cadmium Plated)
The A.M.K. products catalogue that I have says the bolt is the same (but grade 2). but it only has 1" of thread on it.
This is probably a bit pedantic but would anybody have a correct style bolt from a 63 hardtop. I would like to know if the bolt was threaded all the way along the length of the bolt or it was only threaded part of the way. It would then leave a small length of the bolt to the full dia of the bolt.
Many thanks,
Karl.
Rectified the water pump issue. Moving forward.
I am looking at the bolts that hold the exhaust manifold on. I didn't have any manifolds on the engine when I purchased it so I have no bolts to compare with.
The MPC states that the part number is 20408-S7. They are a 3/8"-16 x 1 and 1/8" long hex head bolt. (cadmium Plated)
The A.M.K. products catalogue that I have says the bolt is the same (but grade 2). but it only has 1" of thread on it.
This is probably a bit pedantic but would anybody have a correct style bolt from a 63 hardtop. I would like to know if the bolt was threaded all the way along the length of the bolt or it was only threaded part of the way. It would then leave a small length of the bolt to the full dia of the bolt.
Many thanks,
Karl.
1963 Thunderbird Hardtop
Re: Water pump issues.
Hello Karl, I'm looking in my Ford parts catalog for the 1961 Thunderbird. It shows that the bolt your referring to look that the thread is entire the length of the bolt.It catalog Number is 204 28 -S I hope this helps.
Here is a photo
Here is a photo
1956 Thunderbird Sage Green
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309
Re: Water pump issues.
Thanks Steve.
It is the exhaust manifold bolts that I am looking at. #20408, although the bolts that you describe are 20428, which are the same except that they are a 1/8" longer. There appears to be a short piece under the head of the bolt that is not threaded? Interesting.
Karl.
It is the exhaust manifold bolts that I am looking at. #20408, although the bolts that you describe are 20428, which are the same except that they are a 1/8" longer. There appears to be a short piece under the head of the bolt that is not threaded? Interesting.
Karl.
1963 Thunderbird Hardtop
Re: Water pump issues.
Hi Karl,
last set I purchased from Macs had thread the full length and came with locking studs and washers - I don't recall using the washers though.
Here is a link:
https://www.macsautoparts.com/ford_thun ... 58-66.html
Graeme
last set I purchased from Macs had thread the full length and came with locking studs and washers - I don't recall using the washers though.
Here is a link:
https://www.macsautoparts.com/ford_thun ... 58-66.html
Graeme
1962 Hardtop - in Melbourne, Australia
Re: Water pump issues.
Sorry about that Karl, I was up very early this morning I just dug in my Ford parts book.
1956 Thunderbird Sage Green
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309
Re: Water pump issues.
I have searched my Ford Standard and Utility parts Catalog I think these might be the bolt for the manifold.
1956 Thunderbird Sage Green
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309
Re: Water pump issues.
Graeme, as far as Mac's go I think that they use a lot of parts that will do the job but are quiet universal. This way they don't have to have as many parts in stock.
Thanks for the photo's Steve.
Looking at the list, in the full dia body bolts, part #20408 has a small full size dia bolt under the head. This is the same as what A.M.K. listing says. I will go with that and source a bolt that doesn't have the thread all the way along. I don't like my chances as the most common ones have the thread all the way. I will probably obtain a longer bolt and them machine the bolt back to size.
I would be interested in seeing if anybody does have an original bolt. If they still exist.
Steve the book that you took the photo's out of, is this readily available? and can it be purchased?
Karl.
Thanks for the photo's Steve.
Looking at the list, in the full dia body bolts, part #20408 has a small full size dia bolt under the head. This is the same as what A.M.K. listing says. I will go with that and source a bolt that doesn't have the thread all the way along. I don't like my chances as the most common ones have the thread all the way. I will probably obtain a longer bolt and them machine the bolt back to size.
I would be interested in seeing if anybody does have an original bolt. If they still exist.
Steve the book that you took the photo's out of, is this readily available? and can it be purchased?
Karl.
1963 Thunderbird Hardtop
Re: Water pump issues.
This book is from where I took the photos this is available on E Bay Ford was notorious for using bolts and screws from left over inventory .
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1954-Ford-Stan ... JO&vxp=mtr
Here is another one, might be with newer up dated inventory
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1965-Ford-Stan ... SwZjJU~w3u
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1954-Ford-Stan ... JO&vxp=mtr
Here is another one, might be with newer up dated inventory
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1965-Ford-Stan ... SwZjJU~w3u
1956 Thunderbird Sage Green
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309
1953 Ford Custom Liner Hot Rod With Flat 8 Motor with Henderson three 2 barrel Carbs
VTCI Member # 12309